Linking arrows

[dave]

When linking arrows, is one of the arrows (ON or OFF) always the heirarchy? ie: are arrows always linked one way or does it depend on which way the arrows were linked.

[qmlm1981]

When linking arrows, is one of the arrows (ON or OFF) always the heirarchy? ie: are arrows always linked one way or does it depend on which way the arrows were linked.

No.There is another way to link the arrows.You can place two arrows on the same drawing or two different drawing.There isn't relationship between the twos.And then you can select P&ID-Tools>Maintenance>Match To/From Arrows to link them.

[dave]

Hi qmlm1981, welcome to the board and thank you for your reply! I think I misphrased my question. I understand the PID maint./match to from arrows command so let me give you a hypothetical:

I place an OFF arrow on dwg. 1, then place an on arrow on PID 2 matching the arrow to dwg. 1 arrow.

Then I change the line #, spec, size whatever on dwg. 2 and dwg 1 doesn't update even after a save/asiregenall.

So I make a new line (default size, line no, spec) touch the ON arrow on dwg. 2, get prompted to continue the line off the arrow and low and behold its the line from dwg. 1

Now that I say this, I think the line coming from the ON arrow on dwg 2 may have gotten detached from the arrow. This happens sometimes but I haven't figured that part out yet. If it did become detached, then the arrow would not update the OFF arrow on dwg 1

Again this is only happens sometimes so I really don't know what I am doing wrong. I started to think that the OFF arrows were the "dominant" of the two. I will run some more tests tommorrow and post my results. Most of the time the linking of the arrows works just fine.

[dave]

I talked to a bentley support guy today and he has never heard of that happening. In thier defense, the support guys (and gals) do not draw P&IDs and such. I think they more or less support the database and customization. It is my conclusion that the lines became "detatched" from the arrows and that's why the linking did not seem to work.

I am curious if anyone else has a problem with lines becoming detached from arrows. It seems to be a seemingly random occurence. thanks!

[qmlm1981]

Hi m3_fs,I am a chinese ,my name is Frank.I 'm working on Bentley AutoPLANT series products.I think you have abundant experience with P&ID ,Piping and so on.So, I want to communicate with you further.Shall I?

MSN:shptitan@hotmail.com
Email:qmlm1981@yahoo.com.cn

[dave]

Hi Frank, nice to meet you. I have been working intensively with AutoPlant P&IDs/Data Manager/Project Administrator for the last year and a half or so. I haven't done much in the 3D piping world but I have a pretty firm grasp on the 2D/Data side.
That being said, feel free to ask any question you may have however I do ask that you keep them here in this forum so that others may benefit from the exchange of information. Thanks!

[Aplant Monkey]

As far as I am concerned you should not be linking you arrows till very late in the project IFC probably. the reason is for the reasons you ahve stated above. I have encountered this often, and my conclusions are also mixed except that I think I found that if the runs were different then it would not update properly. It has been a awhile since I linked arrows but as I recall that was one of the issues.

[dave]

hmm, well what do you do about your drawings going out IFA or IFD? Do you manually write in the links in the arrows? And what about your pipe runs? How do you show line annotation carrying on the "linked" drawing?

[Aplant Monkey]

Dave,

what we do is use dumb Acad blocks with attributes to place for off page connectors. Linking drawings has caused us problems in the past. If you think about it the drawings are somewhat linked already as the runs that cross pages should be linked through process.
What benefit is there to linking arrows??

[dave]

True. Your method makes sense. So if I have Line A1 run 1 on PID 1 and that leaves the sheet and enters PID2. So I create Line A1 run 2 on PID 2. Can I change and link the runs by CATTing on the line and changing the run? This will link the runs? Sounds like it would when I read it but I've never done that before.

Often times though we will change drawing numbers to add in an additional on or two which could throw off many others downstream of it. If your arrows are linked, they will pick up the drawing number change in the arrow. A small benefit compared to the hassles, problem and "wtf's" I get from the engineers. Thanks!

[dave]

Monkey, do you erase all of the run terminators? Even on reducers?

[Aplant Monkey]

We ahve been in the habbit of erasing all terminators except those at the very begining of a line and at the termination of that line ensuring that the first (begining) instance of a line is named Run 1.

We have recently been experimenting with leaving all terminators in as it is easier to manage the run table that the terminator table. the only catch is to make sure you name the first Run, Run 1 and then the last run Run 1A or whatever you want. Then set up your Line Designation Table (LDT) to search for those runs and place them in the LDT.

We are still working with this method but it seems to work well.