Switching Equipment Tag Types

[ammdumas]

sigh. :x

I just found out one of our users hasn't actaully been following the prompts as he is inserting equipment onto a drawing. because of this, he has been putting all equipment as the generic AT_EQUIP tag type.

Is there an easy way to switch certain objects from AT_EQUIP to, say, AT_EQPMP or AT_EQTNK? If it's as simple as switching the tag type in the related field in the EQUIP table, cool. I just wanted check before actually doing it.

[Colby]

I have very little knowledge of AutoPlant P&ID, BUT if it was me I would find a blunt object and proceed to RESET the user...

Again that is just me....... :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:


M3_fs what would you do?????

[ammdumas]

Tempting... :twisted: ...but no. We're low on staff as is :lol: .

Any less violent solutions?

[dave]

haha, well I would choose the blunt object optionn as well. BUT if that isn't an option...
Personally, I only use the AT_EQUIP table for my equipment so I have never run across this problem and when I have (Instruments and such) I had to erase the block > save > re-do the right way. If you try and add in the tag the correct way without erasing the old (creating an additional link) you'll get that "This tag number exists under a different tag type" error. Hmmm, I will have to try some stuff. If it's just one user and hasn't done too much I would make him erase and re-tag all the equipment. Thus insuring he won't do it again....riiiiigghhht.

[ammdumas]

Actually, this all comes about from my previous post about deleting objects but not the record. Two steps forward, one step back...

The user created an object in error. He deletes the object, but not the record. He creates a new object and then tries to 'create additional link' but he can't. The reason being is because the new object was created under the AT_EQPMP tag type, but he's trying to associate the link to the old AT_EQUIP record. Hence big red X after the big yellow !.

Plus side, records can't be re-used (which is good if your revisions have hit 'issued for construction') and data entered in Data Manager is kept. Bad new is, you can't delete anything from the system (even if it was a quick entry in error that you want to change right away). You can remove all links from that 'deleted' record, but you can't remove the record entirely. Worse, you can't re-associate if records are different tags types (but you want to use the same equipment number). Now you have a bunch of deleted records in your Views that you don't want to show and gaps in your numbering convention. Now I have to go into all the Views and modify the query so that it ignores all status 'DEL' records.

arg. :x

[dave]

or delete the record right from the proper table in the .adp?

[ammdumas]

.adp?

I'm guessing you're talking about the EQUIP table in the projdata.mdb file, but not sure. Is that an SQL thing? We haven't switched our server yet (yes, still using pure MS Access, we're in the dark ages here). But I'm also afraid that by deleting the record in one table, you'll have orphaned records in all the other tables (I.e. EQP_LNK, TAG_REG, etc.). I purged all the links in the View from Data Manager (clicking yes to prompt after trying to delete the record outright), but that doesn't instill me with too much confidence...

[dave]

ah yes the old "linked tags deleting orphaning data on other PIDs that you don't discover till a month from now when you go to IFC" - been there too man. Yeah we use an MSDE db which uses the .adp file extension. It's the same as your mdb. Tell me, can you get in and do regular access stuff VBA, creating forms, stuff like that?

[ammdumas]

I've asked that of Bentley, and they said no, I have to be on the SQL server (I asked because I want to create triggers).

Why? do you have a back-door fix? Whatever it is, I'll take it, 'cause I'm good at jerry-rigging... :roll:

[dave]

sadly no, very little fun stuff you can do in DM. Though I may try doing it through SQL...if I ever get time.

[ammdumas]

Ok. However, I just thought of another question.

People can associate an object to an existing record in the system. This should be a 1 to 1 relationship (at least in my world anyways). However, as far as I can tell, there's nothing stopping a user from associating multiple objects to one tag, even across several drawings.

Is there a way to stop this? Or at least have a prompt indicating that there is already an association with another object on a drawing? Right now, the prompt just says that the tag exists, not that it's being associated elsewhere... :?

[Aplant Monkey]

Just finished reading your entries.

guys... just go to the Tag_Reg and change the tag type to whatever you want AT_Equip or AT_Equipmp or drum or whatever it doesn't matter. You are right though that you can't link two objects that are different taga types,,,, sooo just change one. I have done this many times and it has always worked. I am working on SQL though.

One other thing you mentioned that seems odd to me is that you say after "deleting" ( I hate that term... much prefer erase) that you still seem to have legacy data hanging around DM. This should not happen if the item was "erased" properly. Try typing "SLP" at the command line. this will bring up the intelligence nodes that are associated with the objects. You will be able to see if they are in their proper position (over top of the item) if they are not type "movexdpts" this will move them back to their parent graphics. once this is doen you can see if there remains any that are kinda hanging out on their own. CATT on them and see if they are your orphaned data, if so just "erase" them.

I make a point of saying erase as opposed to delete as the delete key ONLY removes the graphics not the intelligence of the object thus leaving legacy data behing and creating these problems.

Hope this helps, let me know if you need some clarity. :shock:

[ammdumas]

Good to know. Considering the nature of the system, I wasn't going to trust myself with 'just changing the tag type'. But now that I have clarification, I'm changing away!

I'll try that SLP thing too.

[Aplant Monkey]

glad to help...good luck

we often need it dealing with AP

[dave]

Thanks for that clarification Autoplant Monkey and welcome to the forum! I did not know you could change the tag_type either.

[Packin31]

Since we started to use the newest version of AutoPLANT the 3d piping model is now linked up with the P&ID. We have been having trouble with TAG types. For instance the P&ID has Vessels (tag type AT_DRUM) we go to place it in the model and it states that this tag number is associated with a different TAG type. We also have the same problems placing some instruments in the 3d model. What I have done is the same procedure Aplant Monkey stated
guys... just go to the Tag_Reg and change the tag type to whatever you want AT_Equip or AT_Equipmp or drum or whatever it doesn't matter.

We have standard P&IDs that we start a project with so I have edited these standards with the above and so far it seems to be working okay. I may have to go back in and fix a few tags but at least it is not the whole project.

[PlantWorker]

In earlier versions of P&Id, you could place a motor with an existing pump-tag, after accepting the "additional link" statement, it would link the motor symbol to the pump-tag, it would be nice to have that feature again.
Ther is a tool (a separate exe ) from bentley that allows to change instr and equip tagtypes for existing objects. Can i upload that in this forum ? otherwize give me you mail if you want it.[/url]

[dave]

Hi PlantWorker, welcome to the site. I'm still working on a upload feature but in the meantime, email me your attachment and I will post it here. m3_fs@yahoo.com - give it the subject "plantworker"

Thanks!

[dave]

Here is the Change Tag Type program from Plantworker

DOWNLOAD HERE (http://www.davetyner.com/plantworker/ChgTagType.exe)

[Aplant Monkey]

Very cool!!

thanks for that Plantworker :lol:

[PlantWorker]

there is a seoparate tool from Bentley that allows to change the tagtype of existing objects ... It's not too big, i can mail it if u want. Don't understand why they don't include it in the software.

[dave]

Plantworker, we now have the ability to attach files to a post. Why not give that a try :)

[PlantWorker]

just unzip it and start the exe, no installation
it will prompt for a dll (might depend on version(s) you have installed), just take the default

Type INIT in the dialog to select a project.

Edit: I moved this attachment here (http://www.davetyner.com/forum/autoplant-pid/t-change-tag-type-217.html)

[dave]

Great tool!